Topic started by barathi periyan (@ c-24-129-33-48.se.client2.attbi.com) on Sat Feb 22 11:47:51 .
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Can someone send me the translation of the song Chinnan Cheru Keliya Kannama song?? Is this song a part of Kannan songs?? I would like to know the full translation and under what circumstances Mahakavi composed this song..
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Responses:
- From: akil (@ ac9f4bd0.ipt.aol.com)
on: Sat Feb 22 14:10:09
its not kannamma song not kannan song.
kannama is barathi's dream character. he has composed quite a few like 'kannamma en kaathali.. lover'.. 'kannamma en kuzhanthai'.
this particular song portrays kannamma as kuzhanthai (child). but films have adopted this song for love.
chinnan chiru kiliyE - kaNNamma
selva kalanjiyamE
chinnan chiru = tiny; kili = parrot
selva = wealth; kalaynjiyam = treasure
do u want the whole song's translation. i'm lazy. i will translate first few lines.
ennai kali theerthE - ulagil
Etram puriya vanthaay
i don't know the meaning of 'kali theerthe' (may be .. solving my problems/faults)
ulagil = in this world; vanthaay = u came; Etram puriya = to develop/improve; ennai = me.
pillai kaniyamuthE - kaNNamma
pesum poR chithiramE
pillai = child; kaniyamuthE (kani = fruit, amuthu = tasty food; amuthu in mythology is the tastiest liquid that gives 'divinity'. but thats not the meaning here. it just means kaniyamuthu - a tasty meal of fruits);
pesum - talking; poR - golden; chitiram - art.
u r a golden art which could talk.
aLLi aNaithidavE - en munnE
aadi varum thEnE
en munnE - in front of me; aadi varum - come dancing; thenE - honey
aLLi - to carry; aNaithidavE - to cuddle/embrace;
(u r coming dancing in front of me, to carry and cuddle u. )
Odi varugaiyilE - kaNNamma
ullang kuLiruthadee
When u come running, my mind gets cooled.
aadi thirithal kaNdaal - unnai
aavi thazhuvuthadi
when i see u wander dancing, my life(aavi = uyir) embraces u.
uchi thanai mugarnthaal - karuvam
Ongi vaLaruthadi
when i smell/kiss ur forehead, my pride grows.
mechi unai ooRaar - pugazhnthaal
mEni silirkuthadee
when people in the town praise u, i get goose pimples on my body.
kannathil muthamittaal - uLLanthaan
kaLveri kolluthadi.
if i kiss on ur cheek, my mind gets the feeling of boose /euphoria (kaLveri.. kaL = alcohol, they prepare from palm)
- From: Hari Krishnan (@ dialpool-210-214-128-136.maa.sify.net)
on: Sat Feb 22 22:46:18
chinnan chiru kiLiyE is very much a part of kaNNan paadalgaL. The kaNNan
paattu contains 22 songs in all, placing kaNNan in different roles. These
were written over a period of four years, starting from 1913. The first song
that was written in this collection is the one that depicts kaNNan as mother
- kaNNan - en thaai. It is interesting to see Bharati calling the Lord in
mother's form as kaNNan - en thaai, instead of kaNNamma - en thaai.
kaNNamma seems to be a later coinage.
A closer study would reveal that almost every role in which Bharati perceived
kaNNan has been depicted in both the genders. Be it the sweetheart, child
or the parent. 'theeradha viLayaatuu piLLai' is about the son and 'chinnan
chiru kiLiyE' is about the daughter.
There are other kaNNan songs which have not been included under this
classification. The reason is simple. Bharati published these 22 songs
when he was alive. After his death, Bharati Prasuralyam took up publication
of his poems and they did not in any way alter the way Bharati published
kaNNan paattu. Other kaNNan paadalgaL that were written after the
publication of kaNNan paattu, and also those which were not included in the
original collection were published under the category, 'miscellaneous'.
I am not able to understand why Barathi Periyan is asking for a translation! I trust he can read Tamil. In case Tamil fonts are not installed in your PC, please do so, which are availbale for free, so that this discussion can continue in Tamil. 'oru thamizhan innum evvaLavu naaLukku innordu thamizhanudan aangilaththil uraiyaada vENdum?' endru kEtta mahaa kavikku naam kaatum mariyaadhai adhuthan. It is a different matter if there are some constraints like not being able to read Tamil due to techical reasons etc. and that is why I am writing in English now.
I will continue with 'chinnan chiru kiLiyE' soon. Before that I want to know if there still is a valid reason as to why we should continue this discussion in English. While it is possible to translate the song, the beauty would be lost. This is one of those songs that Montgomery mentioned, translation of which would be like an attempt to collect the dew drop that dazzles at the edge of a blade of grass. The substance will remain as it is, but the dazzle would be lost.
- From: TamilNattan (@ cvg-65-27-251-73.cinci.rr.com)
on: Sun Feb 23 01:39:06
In a recent movie (snEhindhanE, snEhindhanE) song, I heard the following lines and thought about this Bharathi song.
"Koondhal neLivil
Ezhil kuzhal sarivil
Karuvam azhindhadhadee"
Bharathiyaar says karuvam Ongiyadhu, but this person says karuvam azhindadhu. Onnu uchi, innonnu koondhal.
- From: Pasupathy (@ hse-hamilton-ppp189973.sympatico.ca)
on: Sun Feb 23 09:07:08
Hari:
Interesting thread... Let me tell my own conjecture:
1) 'kaNNammA' is a very interesting word, indeed.
2) the poem 'cinnannj ciRu kiLiyE' contains a line under it, which says clearly " that the poem is about seeing parAsakthi as a child". I have not seen anyone emphasizing this.
3) My own conjecture : 'kaNNammaa' has been used by azagaNic ciththar in his poems. Bharathi, who calls himself as a ciththar, must have been influenced by this usage.
What do you think?
AzagaNic ciththar is the only one who , in my search, seems to have used this word before. Perhaps those familiar with ciththar songs can find more such usage.
- From: TamilNattan (@ cvg-65-27-251-73.cinci.rr.com) on: Sun Feb 23 09:28:03
Pasupathy, Karuvam Ongyadhaa, ozhindhadhaa?
- From: Pasupathy (@ hse-hamilton-ppp189973.sympatico.ca) on: Sun Feb 23 10:31:15
TamilNattan:
I'm not familiar with the film song you quoted.. Of course, in "c.c.kiLiyE", Bharathi says:
ucci thanai muganthAl-karuvam
. . Ongki vaLarudhadI !
- From: akil (@ ac98c5e1.ipt.aol.com) on: Tue Feb 25 17:32:29
TN..
though tamil film lyricists including kannadhasar and vairamuthu are often very much influenced by old tamil literatures and legends like barathi.. here, in this particular song, i don't think vairamuthu has taken any particular inspiration from barathi.
i think the karuvam in the snehidhanae song represents the male chauvinism that the guy loses at the thalaivi's proximity. but definitely thats a good line.
- From: Aparna (@ cerberus.motive.com) on: Wed Mar 5 13:31:47
Can someone tell me what is the meaning of the song "Nirpadhuve Nadapadhuve" in the Tamil film Bharathi.
I'm not sure if this is even a Bharathiyaar composition, but am interested in the meaning of the song and the crux it is trying to convey.
Thanks in advance.
- From: prathap r (@ ) on: Sat Dec 6 02:36:46
hi aparna.
th song "nirpadhuve " is one of the master pieces of barathi which deals with the existence of this world.whether all things that i see r real or some dreams.
will try to explain u using my little knowledge.
"nirpadhuve,nadapathuve parapathuve
neengal ellam soppanam thano"
alll kind of crestures on this world, u r all real or dreams(soppanam).karpanai thano( only imagination) verum katchi pizhaithano(or some optical illusions).
"ponathellam kanavinai pol pudainthozhinde ponadhanal nanum or kanavo
indha ngalamum poithano"
it says that all the thing so far happened r buried under the time.it sound like a dream(abt the past).so .i am also a dream?my existence is also a dream ?.it means that the world is also a fake thing(which exist only in dream"
vanagame .ilaveyile(warmthof sun), mara cherive(natural esceneries)
neengal ellam kanalin neero(mirage or the illusionary water on summar ).
it excellently deals with maya(thatthe entire world is a illusion).i dont remember all the lines .try to give u soon.if uunderstand the poem u will like it verymuch(it is onf my favourite poem ).no body has explained the existence of nature by an "elegant way"
- From: Madhurabarathi (@ 61.11.77.252) on: Thu Dec 25 00:05:10 EST 2003
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- From: prakash raju (@ 61.11.79.226) on: Thu Dec 25 02:01:32 EST 2003
friends,
i am glad that there are persons chating about barathi and his songs also this is the first time i am visiting this web site
i have a very sad news for all if u like barathi very much i have been searching for barathiyar photo for last six months but i couldnt identify one
if any body has one pls send to my mail id or just tell me where it will be available
i enquired even in the barathi ninaivu illam near partasarthi temple triplicane
regards
prakash raju
- From: SB (@ pcp03026043pcs.plnfld01.nj.comcast.net) on: Fri Jan 23 10:33:48 EST 2004
Hi,
I need the meaning of the Bharathiyar Song "Theeratha Vilayattu Pillai".....please help me !! Especially I need the meaning of the line, "Enaapan Enaiyanendran....." please help !!
- From: TamilNattan (@ cvg-65-27-251-73.cinci.rr.com) on: Sun Feb 23 09:28:03
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