Topic started by Rohan Krishnamurthy (@ pm533-26.dialip.mich.net) on Mon Jul 16 15:47:14 .
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As many of you may know, I am a 14 year old mridangist who is a student of Sri. Guruvayur Dorai. I have played extensively throughout the USA and India, for leading artists like N. Ravikiran, "Flute" Ramani, R. Vedavalli, and many more.
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Responses:
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- From: nick (@ host.sumitomomarine.co.uk)
on: Thu Aug 29 05:38:55
Hari, as you say, I think that compositions can be learned from cassettes/cds, but I do not think that playing technique can be. As to getting the jatis 'right', well, if they sound good when spoken and played then it must be ok, and with such a small vocabulary (less than a dozen words?) we can't be far off in saying what we hear on a tape.
- From: nick (@ host.sumitomomarine.co.uk)
on: Thu Aug 29 05:46:25
a brand new mridangam might give good gumaka, but 'running in' is often necessary. It is also often necessary to increase or reduce the tension or make it more even all round.
Repeated usage seems to make the skin more suple and soft, giving better sound and smoother to the touch.
Sometimes they leave a few goat hairs which need shaving off, or the skin made a little smoother.
WARNING: the skin is actually quite thin; I would not dare take a razor-sharp blade to it, I would get help from my teacher.
Despite my good mridangam 'general knowledge' I do not play very much, and half an hour in my teacher's hands will improve a mridangams sound (both ends) more than hours of me playing it
- From: hari (@ 203.199.213.3)
on: Thu Aug 29 05:59:34
hi
how do u judge umayalpuram sivaraman? his way of playing is quite traditional and very much structured. but he plays gumkis less. i feel he is the maestro of valam thalai.. whatever may be the taala he will play thani for that immediately.. i remember .. few years back ... a cassettee in which he was accompanying balamuralikrishna.. he sang one ragam thanam pallavi in a thala which he had created. umayalpuram played a thani for that.. will these people have an understanding before the concerts? or they just play extempore..
- From: nick (@ host.sumitomomarine.co.uk)
on: Thu Aug 29 09:01:19
It is part of the skill of a professional mridangam player. My teacher could certainly do that: he told me that if you audition for AIR you have to be able to play any tala they set you on the spot.
It's part having a memory stacked full of hundreds of patterns, thiermanams, korvais etc, and part being able to calculate on the spot, but all based on the ability to grasp and understand the structure of any talam quickly. The amazing thing is that however mathematical this music is it has to *sound musical*, not just calculate correctly.
- From: nick (@ host.sumitomomarine.co.uk)
on: Thu Aug 29 09:07:38
re previous understanding... for a recording, I would have thought so, but for stage program, unless the musicians have been touring together, or played together a lot in the past, it is completely new as it happens. The only area im which any kind of rehearsal is common is accompanying dance.
- From: nick (@ host.sumitomomarine.co.uk)
on: Thu Aug 29 09:13:53
Simple when you know how...
Say any adi talam korvais to rupaka talam. The first two times you will appear to be way off, the third time will come back to the samam. my guruji: "we don't learn too many rupaka korvais, because we can always do this. Also, we use it to tease, because the first time people will think, 'he has made a bad mistake", the second time, 'worse!', and then they will be surprised to see it come right at the third time.
- From: Rohan (@ 24.247.121.197.kzo.mi.chartermi.net)
on: Thu Aug 29 15:24:31
UKS is certainly a very attractive mridangist. He is possibly one of the most attractive mridangist the carnatic music scene has ever seen. It is mainly due to his outstanding clarity of fingerings (which are not only produced by his long fingers but the arduous hours of practice he put in when he was younger). He is a very brilliant artist and many times steals the show (which is not a bad thing). The entire spectrum of the audience can appreciate his playing, from the layman to the connoiseur. This is certainly a very tremendous achievement! His playing is actually highly influenced by Palghat Mani iyer. To my observation, UKS has adapted the style Mani Iyer used with solo instrumental performers like TNK, etc (bolder and faster patterns). All in all, a very exceptional mridangist. Just keep one thing in mind, do not try to imitate him! That type of clarity is rare. Only a few artists have that, one being Thiruvavyur Bakthavaslam.
- From: Rohan (@ 24.247.121.197.kzo.mi.chartermi.net)
on: Thu Aug 29 15:27:05
Learning from cassettes is fine as long as you have the fundamentals down. You can pick up some cholus from artists, but be alert that your fingering matches theirs. For instance, many of Pazhani's cholus are reprodcuible with other fingerings, but if played in such a manner, lose their Pazhani identity.
I have picked up numerous patterns and techniques from cassettes. Many people, including Ravikiran, etc., say I have a heavy influence of the Murughabhupathy style. I have never heard him live, but have heard several recordings and have seemingly picked up on that.
- From: Rohan (@ 24.247.121.197.kzo.mi.chartermi.net)
on: Thu Aug 29 15:34:55
One thing also is that many of the modern recordings alter the sound of the mridangam, namely by increasing the treble and procuding a tabla like sound. This robbs the mridangam of all its weight and tone. You should either hear the modern artists live or listen to old recordings. Even though the technology was poor, you got a very pure sound of the mridangam in the old recordings.
You should aim to create the same effect as the mridangam artist has on the recording.
- From: pramodh (@ ac85f35f.ipt.aol.com)
on: Thu Aug 29 17:22:17
umayalpuram is quite pleasing to hear from a rasika point of view.There is an exceptional tone to his playing. Thiruvarur has the same tone but doesnt have the same variety when it comes to the rhythmic patterns. It tends to get monotonous after a while. He tends to be disturbingly loud at times.
- From: pramodh (@ ac85f35f.ipt.aol.com)
on: Thu Aug 29 17:23:44
Certainly the older recordings have the originality to the tone. We have discussed regarding the new recordings in detail before
- From: Rohan (@ 24.247.121.197.kzo.mi.chartermi.net)
on: Thu Aug 29 19:14:15
Thiruvarur is also a very good mridangist. He is very adept in calculations as well as complex fingerings. I heard him play an entire thani in khanda nadai in India last Music Season in Bhartiya Vidya Bhavan. It was extravagant!
He can be "loud" at times, but overall he is a fine mridangist. He has a dominating style (which is good), which makes rasikas aware of his presence. He never takes back seat.
- From: Rohan (@ 24.247.121.197.kzo.mi.chartermi.net)
on: Thu Aug 29 20:37:41
About the structure of a thani...
I (as well as many mridangist) have to come to the consensus that in a 3 hour concert, a thani must be at least 15 mins long. Many "rasikas" may say that that is too long, but you'll find that they are the same people with hardly a drop of knowledge of basic layam. People like Mani Iyer, Pazhani, and CSM would play 20 min thanis by themselves, and longer if a khanjira, etc., was also performing. 15 mins is the minimum time to show one's prowess in the field of layam, which by no means is inferior to melody.
- From: hari (@ 203.199.213.3)
on: Fri Aug 30 01:15:26
hi
thiruvarur is exceptionally good at accompanying as well as thani. recently i heard two three programmes of thiruvarur. one in which he accompanied TV sankaranarayanan.. there he made it a mess by dominating too much.. some may argue that it is the right way for TVS style. but anyway i did not like that.. vellore ramabhadran will accompany TVS excellently.
but the other day i heard he was playing for flute ramani.. that was too good.. he was literally involved and playing exactly to the songs with excellent gumkis and all.. astonishingly both the places his thani was in khanda nada.. years before once when he was accompanying TVS at vaikom temple, he played a thani ..that too was in khanda nada..he has terrible practice on mridangam... he is too good with yesudas also especially when he sings light songs
- From: hari (@ 203.199.213.3)
on: Fri Aug 30 01:22:56
hi
here is a doubt..when one accompanies instrumentals.. he has to have a good knowledge of the songs , right? because unlike vocal they can't show the beats of the tala with hand..mridangist should have great experience of accompanying. i have umayalpuram takes one of his senior desciples with him when he accompanies instrumetals..
- From: hari (@ 203.199.213.3)
on: Fri Aug 30 01:25:22
i mean...
i have seen umayalpuram taking his desciples for showing tala when he accompanies instrumentals.
- From: hari (@ 203.199.213.3)
on: Fri Aug 30 02:27:00
hi
Wish You all the very best on the occasion of Janmashtami!!!
hari
- From: nick (@ host.sumitomomarine.co.uk)
on: Fri Aug 30 06:00:17
No accompaniest (proffessional) professional relies on artist puting tala:
1. Some of them don't. or do only sometimes
2. Some of them do but get it wrong at least sometimes.
The mridangist above all others on stage must know exactly the talam all the time. But he must also be able to accompany what the vocalist *is* singing where it differs from what they *should* be singing. Recently I saw a young student perform, she has a beatiful voice and is very gifted, but was not on form that day: she took all kind of liberties with the tala, but the mridangist never faltered and never allowed her mistakes to show against his playing.
good mridangists *do* know the songs as well as the instrumentalists/vocalists know them. Many mridangists will quickly identify the raga and make a good guess at what the song will be.
Simple rhythm one can always follow, but think of a varnam or thillana: how could you play it if you did not know it. Mind you, even with these it must occasionally happen that the artist comes up with a new or unknown composition.
I once asked a violin player if it ever happened that the artist sand a raga he did not know. He replied, "Oh yes, of course: I just have to listen carefully and learn"
And, of course, for the Palavi of an RTP all the accomppaniests have to learn it as they hear it and then do the maths for the different speeds, cope with the niraval and swaras etc.
- From: nick (@ host.sumitomomarine.co.uk)
on: Fri Aug 30 06:09:42
Having a student on stage putting tala is, I think, just an excuse for that person to sit on stage although it is also part of their education. I cannot imagine that any good mridangist, let alone a top mridangist would *need* someone to do it. On the other hand, if there is someone who's ability they trust, on stage or in the audience, they will look to see and use that person's help.
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